What To Do When Your Rav Kav No Longer Works Properly on the Bus

It can be a frightening experience! You've got your Rav Kav for bus travel in Israel - that "awesome" green card (which often needs its own "green card" to actually get permission to work!) You've filled it up (so to speak) with 10 new clips for rides in Jerusalem and you've paid! 

Next ride in town and you find the computer reader on the bus doesn't read the card correctly. The driver tells you there is nothing left on the card, but you insist you just purchased a new Kartisia (bus card of 10 tickets.) Again he tells you you're having him on "Geveret", or "Adoni" and launches into a tirade to get you to purchase a new ticket or get off the bus. Again you explain the situation. He forces the ticket down onto the reader holding it really hard on the computer reader. Then he twists it - practically breaking it in half. Finally the machine clicks and takes your payment.

Don't expect an apology from the driver - even if the ticket that's printed clearly indicates 8 rides still left! The drivers just don't have time for the faults of the Rav Kav company - and with an abundance (sad to say) of a lot of dishonesty of people jumping on buses without paying - he'll tend to be adamant that you pay or get off - whether the ticket should be working or not!

So you get on another bus, and it turns out you go through the same process. Actually you should do something soon, because if you don't, the card might get broken from the force of the driver pressing it on the reader - and then you'll be left with nothing! So here's what you need to know. Following this advice may save you hours - so listen well!

The first thing is a trip into the Central Bus Station in the center of Jerusalem. Don't get excited thinking it will be an easy morning/afternoon. It won't! In fact, you're in for some serious frustration! 

When you arrive there, do not visit the main Kupot (stations that sell the Egged tickets - situated on the third floor). And if it's the last thing in the world you think needs to be done - still - whatever you do, do not visit the Modi'in (information) counter. Should you visit these counters for help, you will be shooed away in no time. As for whatever "information" means, you'll be hearing something like it's just not their concern. In fact, all of the Rav Kav problems are not their concern - except for one, which if you don't realise it before it's too late - you'll be wasting another morning...

That's what happened to us, and after finally learning the ropes, we understood what they wanted. When you arrive at the Tachana HaMerkazit, head to floor 3. Take a tour down a long passage until you reach the main Rav Kav offices. You'll know you're there when you see some 100 people waiting - with the exact same problem as you have! Take a ticket. You'll definitely know you're in the right place when the ticket number says "824" and you realise that the digital display calling the next customer reads "655". Yes, it's going to be a long wait. Apparently the Rav Kav system is not working as splendidly as they thought it would.

When you get through to your turn, you'll have to show your I.D., your ticket, explain your problem and ask them for a refund for the outstanding "clicks" on the ticket. They're not enthusiastic about the complainers. It could be that they never assumed the "faults" department would have only happy people coming through! You'll also often find the group of unhelpful people chatting with each other, shouting at each other, shouting at other clients, or perhaps having coffee. "Look... number 655 has come through and we see that already number 824 has been taken from the number machine... we've got plenty of time!"

If you do survive this experience, they'll take your details - but they will not issue you a refund! They won't give you a credit for the faulty "clicks" still on the card either. And please - don't expect an apology (or a cup of coffee!) They'll then tell you to wait a few weeks, after which you will receive a letter in the mailbox telling you they are going to refund you after all!!! Whoopee! There is a catch... you must redeem the voucher within 90 days, so make sure you do, because you'll probably also notice that the date of issue corresponds to the date of the complaint or shortly thereafter! Time is ticking, don't imagine you really have 90 days left... that was since they issued the letter before posting it a few weeks later - and this "time" is certainly in the favour of Rav Kav! (If you don't do your homework fast, you will effectively be giving them extra payment for rides you never took due to a faulty card!!!)

Part 2...

Once you get your letter of "refund", you go back to Egged/Rav Kav again. But - though it be that the Kupot would not talk to you before about your problems - nor would the Modi'in assist - the tables have now turned. Rav Kav will no longer help you and indeed - you MUST go to the Kupot ONLY!

Should you indeed make the mistake of visiting Rav Kav to discuss the problem card, after waiting another few hours at the Rav Kav station, and take your turn (number 967), you will be met this time with a very straight - or angry face. Before you are even seated, the "gentleman" or "gentlelady" will ask you if you have read your letter well! You'll try to explain you did - but they will shout at you. They'll then send you back to the Kupot place. They will also explain to you that you have not been there - and will not believe your story about the Kupot having clearly said that they have nothing to do with Rav Kav problems - as from the visit before.

Look - you have to judge them favourably here. In all honesty, one can clearly see there is no proper communication between the different departments of Rav Kav or Egged offices. The poor worker (earning his minimum wage just like everyone else in the country) really doesn't have the patience to deal with the *hundreds* of people coming through with the same issues we had... and so his response is pretty much programmed in already!

You'll be shamefacedly sent back to the Kupot - where surprisingly, you'll meet someone who will now help you after all! Though that be the case, he will require you to pay the additional amounts to re-fill your ticket again and will not give you a refund or credit for the amount due - until you pay for the additional tickets! He too is not happy with this dreadful situation which no doubt, he must deal with from hundreds and thousands of unsatisfied customers!

So there it is. Here's the summary:

1. Broken card not working - frustrated driver. More frustrated customer.

2. Visit Egged - Tachana HaMerkazit. GO TO RAV KAV OFFICE - (and take a ticket quickly!!!)

3. After reading your Bible - from start to finish (or any other lengthy book), you'll be just in time for your appointment with "Mr/s Helpful!"

4. Show your ID and report the problem. (Don't forget to say "thank you", smile, and feel like a million dollars!)

5. Go home... wait for a few weeks.

6. Check post box regularly for the golden letter.

7. Once said letter arrives, you've got 90 days to repair the damage (from the date of the letter two months before... not from date of receipt!)

8. Go back to Egged - but this time to the Kuppot for a "refund."

9. Pay the extra amount they ask (whatever it is.) Don't argue. It won't help!

10. Have your brand new working card "charged."

Enjoy the rest of your day - and all your further bus trips. Rav Kav is here to stay!

Rav Kav - How to Get an Anonymous Bus Ticket and Get Organised!

If you read my previous post about the problems associated with the Rav Kav public transportaion card in Israel, you'll notice I posted a solution suggested by some friends. Today we were able to implement the solution and it worked!

To recap: Your Rav Kav ticket will allow you to purchase a variety of city and inter-city tickets. There's a catch though! The machine used to scan the card never knows which ticket to scan - and may well scan the wrong ticket costing you extra money! Certainly - it is the duty of the driver to code into his machine which ticket to take, but I've found most drivers to be unpleasant about this and even insulted when I've asked them to select the right ticket. This has resulted in an actual loss of money for me having had the wrong ticket "punched" numerous times! I've complained to Egged (with no response) and to Illit Kavim (having had them refund me ₪20 once) but the bottom line is that the problem still exists. It surprises me that the managers running the Rav Kav operation - no doubt qualified MBA's, honours, masters or Phd qualified B.Com graduates or even possibly CA's have no understanding of the issues facing the true problem of the card - but such is it.

So here's what will practically happen: You use your Rav Kav for a city ticket, an inter-city ticket and a combined ticked which is cheaper (when it works!) for travel between and within another city too! However, when the driver chooses to use a regular city ticket when you've already selected the combined ticked - you'll be charged more than double the amount as the computer will deduct both inter-city i.e. two tickets, then city - and then when you try to use the intercity on return you find that an extra ticket was deducted in the city - with you now losing two additional tickets for the inter-city ticket! 

If you don't follow that - the summary is that the machine that scans the ticket has no way of knowing which ticket you want to use. The driver may have an ego not wanting to let you use the one you want to, and you finding yourself at a loss of two or more tickets - wasted!

In the old days we used paper tickets which allowed us to have control of which ticket to use. But without the individual tickets, we can no longer keep track of what the driver and scanning machine are doing to the Rav Kav!

The solution: Get yourself a separate Rav Kav for every journey you make that requires a different ticket! I don't remember this being available at the start of the Rav Kav with their rules allowing only one ticket - but I see this is no longer applicable!

All you need to do is to go in to the main Egged bus station (Jerusalem), floor 3 - and ask for an anonymous Rav Kav. You can get as many as you like for the price of ₪5. It may cost something - but you'll be saving a fortune due to not having to deal with problematic bus drivers, Rav Kav machines and the tremendous stress you will experience having to explain to the driver how the Rav Kav actually does work - or finding out just how much you have lost due to drivers not using the machine correctly! Do'n't forget to label your cards so you know which ticket is on which card.

It's easy to do! Never ask the drivers for this anonymous Rav Kav ticket on the bus (though they should have) because they never have - forcing you to hope and pray that the next bus arriving will have. Just go in to the Egged bus station directly - a once off - get your additional Rav Kav's - and you're all set for an honest and stress free public transportation experience! BeHatzlacha - and a big thank you to those who helped me to sort this all out!

Rav Kav - Israel's Bus Ticket: Friend or Foe?

Some time ago Israel introduced the Rav Kav public transport ticket. It certainly looks like a fun ticket with a green colour that says "go!" and an icon logo (not the cartoon character numbered 2) that says "fun" or perhaps "speed", but was it really created for the benefit of the public commuter or was there perhaps another reason (such as to simply create confusion and further the public transport economy through "alternative" means (sic - read below,) that it was put into place? 

I'm not sure, but I'm going to tell you my personal story and the battles I have experienced with it. This story is here for everyone to learn from and prepare (and arm(!)) themselves well so that the "mistakes" I have made are not made by others. At the end of the article I'm going to share with you the ultimate solution of saving you (and me!) not running into trouble again! I'm thankful to a group of friends who agreed with me on the problems this card has brought, and who shared with me their solution which finally puts the consumer back in control of his bus ticket - something which the Rav Kav will take away from anyone not prepared!

To be honest, I'm not sure if Egged is to blame, Illit bus lines (Kavim) are to blame or if it's the Rav Kav card - and who actually determines how it works - that is to blame.

The famous Rav Kav (having no relationship to any Rabbinical authority or organisation) allows one to purchase a variety of tickets on it. The catch is, only the Rav Kav (and its accompanying "partner in crime" - the machine that it is scanned upon) knows what's happening when the card is scanned. Buying bus tickets in Israel now no longer affords the consumer the opportunity to ever see how many tickets he has left etc. as the ordinary paper kind allowed. There are apparently apps on smartphones that allow one to check - but this only helps those who own them. There are also booths that are situated in select areas - but unless you live nearby one, they are virtually out of reach for the average person. As for the drivers, it's rare to find a driver who will allow you to see how many tickets you have left - though he can easily do so using the machine on the bus. So all in all - your stuck with a card that completely hides any information about the content of tickets on it.

Here's a practical example: If you purchase a 10 "punch" ticket in Jerusalem using your Rav Kav, you get ten rides (if you are lucky - see below.) If you purchase a 5 "punch" ticket from Beitar to Jerusalem, you get 5 regular rides in that direction. If however you want to be "smart" (quotes there for good reason!) you can purchase a Hemshech (continuation trip) ticket which allows you ONE ride from Beitar to Jersualem, and then ONE ride in Jerusalem itself - at a "fraction" (quotes again for good reason!) of the cost. But here's the catch: The computer ticket machine cannot read your mind as to which ticket you want. When you place the card on the machine, it takes off whatever it reads. If you have purchased THREE separate tickets (one regular Jerusalem, one regular Illit and one Hemshech, the computer does not know what to read when it is placed on the machine - as the computer does not know what you are planning for the day!) There is little you can do about it - unless...

You can of course tell the driver to please use the Hemshech. Begging him to use it (instead of just the regular scan) may also be a necessity. I have found most drivers intolerant to listening to what I have asked for, most either telling me they know what to do - or that I can just place the card on the machine because the computer is already programmed "correctly"! 

At the end of the day, if he refuses and makes use of one of the other tickets (his ego having being hurt), you have no recourse. You're stuck with the ticket he chooses for you. This means, if you're hoping to save money by using the "continuation trip" ticket and he selects another, you will be forced to use the normal and thereby pay MORE. On the other hand, if Driver A chooses "continuation trip" ticket, and Driver B in Jerusalem uses REGULAR (i.e. not making use of your original continuation trip ticket!) you will not only pay more for the regular, you will also have paid for the entire "continuation" ticket, losing BOTH amounts!!!

It's not the first time this has happened to me - though yesterday it was just too much... "Fortunately" I met a "lovely" driver on the Illit bus, who pointed out it must have been Egged's fault. (G-d forbid to even suggest that something he did was incorrect and that the fault could easily be corrected by cancelling the ticket and going about things differently!) It was also "fortunate" to have two of his friendly bodyguards accompanying him on his obviously new found job - who refused to accept any blame. By the sounds in their voices, they were more likely employed to act as security on the bus than already-accomplished-drivers who had been employed to instruct the driver on how to deal with ticket-taking and bus driving for the Illit company - but what can one do?! They had a great laugh at my expense! Nobody was prepared to give me their names to allow me to lodge a complaint (the companies always ask you who was involved as if asking the criminals for their names will really help!) - though on returning home, I did so with both Illit and Egged using the bus registration number. Let me equally mention here that I had indeed complained about this issue before to Illit Kavim who after some 3 months of serious meetings about the issue - eventually refunded me - an admission of guilt amount- of 20 Shekel credit for my loss.

All in all, it meant losing the value of TWO full Hemshech tickets, one additional regular Beitar ticket and an additional Egged ticket - in order to "save" money by making use of the one famous Hemshech (continuation trip) ticket!

Totally frustrated I shared my problem with others who came up with the ultimate solution. I'm offering it to all today - until legal attention is given to the problems that will of necessity come up with a computerised card manned by intolerant drivers whose egos are more important than honest business.

The solution: Buy 2 Rav Kav cards!!! Additionally as another friend pointed out - buy an additional Rav Kav card for every single ticket you use. Example: If you use a regular Jerusalem ticket in Jerusalem, use one Rav Kav for this. When traveling in Beitar (or any other city that uses the Rav Kav), use ANOTHER Rav Kav for Beitar. When traveling Hemshech Jerusalem-Beitar - use YET ANOTHER Rav Kav. When traveling, present the card you know has the correct ticket on it. In this way, you avoid having to instruct the driver which ticket he should use on the one individual card!

It's a simple solution. It also tells the Rav Kav company - we're not prepared to settle for a flawed system. Yes, it will cost a little extra for the additional cards - but in the long run, the money and stress saved from working this way is sure to make everybody once again feel as though they are using their paper tickets - which they can clearly be aware of for themselves! Putting us back in charge means not allowing the transport department to fabricate additional ways of removing money from a legal card meant for other journeys!

For those wanting to find out more about understanding the intricacies of this card, do see Egged's page about it as well as the Transport in Israel web page.